What's So Funny About Peace, Love, and the Power of Music?

Image from the cover of Keep On Pushing: Black Power Music from Blues to Hip-hop (2011)

Denise Sullivan represents the insider intellectual stamina of rock 'n' roll journalism without the pomp and pretense. She is the past and future of the form, rolled into one uncanny style.

New Media and the Art of the Interview

Two of your books highlighted the roles of people who were both outsiders and yet found a tremendous niche and success -- R.E.M., R.E.M.: Talk About the Passion and White Stripes, White Stripes: Sweethearts of the Blues Did writing those books demystify the bands for you, and do you feel you would write from a different slant, if you tackled them today?

My experience in writing books is that you never really know where it’s going to go until you get there. I started those projects loving both bands because their music moved me; as artists, I perceived them to have depth and integrity. What I largely found out is that musical artists are complex people and humans like the rest of us. And yet, the music remains, like a character or a force in itself, and generally, the music the bands made and their messages were positive and worth carrying forward.

Book: R.E.M.: Talk about the Passion--An Oral History

Author: Denise Sullivan

Publisher: Da Capo

Publication date: 1998-08


So no, I don’t think I would take a different slant if I wrote about those subjects today and when I update both books soon, I look forward to chronicling the ends of both bands, as well as what their continuous legacies mean. But if you are asking when I listen to either band, do I hear them the same way I used to, the answer is, no.

But I will tell you this: The White Stripes were the single best band to came out of the first ten years of the decade, period. They drew from a deep well so perhaps people perceive they don’t have “time” to get into their whole trip. That’s OK. They’re here to stay and will be here when you’re ready. Plus, in my experience, kids who really know music love the band.

Make no mistake, they are rock ’n’ roll giants, which is why I bothered to write a book about them. Most new bands don’t merit that kind of study, and they certainly don’t enjoy the kind of devotion the Whites Stripes did from their fans. They were drawn into the fire the way Bo Diddley, the Rolling Stones, Jimi Hendrix, Iggy Pop, the Cramps were. They are the real deal: rock 'n' roll.

Both of us began in the print medium, which has been profoundly altered this last decade. Looking back, how would you compare the age of Creem to Pitchfork, or Trouser Press to Buddyhead?

Well for one thing, I don’t read Pitchfork or Buddyhead, whereas I would read Creem and Trouser Press, as if they were my job, like studying sacred texts or breathing. They were required reading, as were Rolling Stone and the NME, if you were preparing yourself to be a rock journalist (and from the age of nine, I was), or a serious fan. Online reading is more like glancing, and I’m not sure how much information is actually contained in the stories; I can pretty much live without it.

That said, I wrote for Crawdaddy! online from 2007-2011, and we tried to deliver a daily with some heft to it, within the blog format. I also loved being part of a team and contributing to our identity, though too much new media is faceless—I want to get to know the writers—and I see too many inaccuracies and too many reposted press releases passing as journalism. Of course there are always exceptions and I like being surprised so if you tell me of a good destination site, I’ll check it out.

When we talk about skimming the Internet and faceless new media, I also think about the endless immediacy and banter of social networks, like a fanzine maker potentially in every home. Yet, I was never very compelled by columns and profiles nearly as much as interviews, which seem lost on the web. In the onslaught of blogging and Tweets, has the art of the interview, ala old Rolling Stone, suffered?

I think it has, though occasionally, you’ll catch one that really rises and delivers. Rarely do I read interviews with people I want to read about, which address the questions I’d like to ask so I take it upon myself to do that. As a close listener and a close reader, I take in the whole catalog, the whole person into account before I interview. But anyone who edits or writes about new releases and new artists for a living, and has to do it in short form for new media (and even old media, like dailies and weeklies) will tell you there’s little time for that when you’re trying to make your deadline and mesh with the market concerns of your publisher.

In terms of new digital media, have you ever find yourself wanting to interview a subject recently, and the editor balked, or wanted you to cut, reframe, or edit a piece, even though the web is supposedly more free and open?

I’ve been lucky in that my profile ideas have rarely been censored or vetoed by the editors I work for regularly, but my cold queries are rejected all the time! At ,Crawdaddy! I was fortunate to be able to interview legends simply because they were legends and not necessarily selling anything. But recently I wanted to interview LaLa Brooks; she sang “Da Do Ron Ron” and “And Then He Kissed Me” on the Crystals records produced by Phil Spector and has led an interesting life since then and she still performs. I figured it was time for her to have her say, but I had no takers on that idea. That’s a story that I would’ve wanted to read and I truly believe there are people that would’ve wanted to read it, too. I’m not sure what the problem was other than she wasn’t being marketed by a happening label or remade by a fancy producer: She’s just a singer who gave her life to rock ’n’ roll, and as it's been said, rock ’n’ roll always forgets...

Book: Rip it Up!: Rock 'n' Roll Rulebreakers

Author: Denise Sullivan

Publisher: Hal Leonard

Publication date: 2001-06


Your book Rip it Up!: Rock 'n' Roll Rulebreakers ran the gamut from Ramblin Jack Elliot and Shonen Knife to Julian Cope, a real gumbo. If you compiled a similar book covering the last decade, who would you argue deserves to be included, and why?

Rip It Up! took in 20 artists, from the ‘50s to the ‘90s, that I previously interviewed, largely as a reporter at the Contra Costa Times in Northern California. But if I were to do an updated version for the 21st Century and could make a list of musicians to speak with, I’d definitely want to talk to M.I.A., and maybe Santigold, two artists that I don’t read about nearly as much as I’d like to, which as I say, is often a starting point for me.

As successful as they might seem, I’d probably also want to dig into the recent uprising of the Roots who’ve become like stewards of 50 years of rock music, and learn more personal details about innovators like Danger Mouse and TV on the Radio and what makes them go. All the artists I’ve mentioned so far have something in common: They’ve had a taste of the mainstream, and yet they still reside on the fringes---which isn’t easy to pull off.

I also like the story of Charlotte Gainsbourg--the family history, the multi-disciplinary talent and that acting is her primary medium—but I think she’s a real rocker, coming into her own. I love Mariam and Amadou, the blind singing duo from Mali, and I also always root for unsung singer-songwriters, so I’d include Hanni El Khatib from California and Ron Franklin, also known as Gasoline Silver, who works largely out of New York and Memphis.

So there’s your mix--another group of artists breaking rules and inspiring others to shake things up while striving to create a strong, unbreakable identity of their own. I admire the courage and risks taken by artists who are seeking something larger than commercial gain or celebrity, those who are committed to their own journey of self-discovery and to making the world a better place. I've picked up some essential information about living from these artists; their wisdom is in my toolkit, now.

Note to readers, see excerpt of Keep on Pushing: Black Power Music from Blues to Hip-Hop published here on PopMatters.

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